Scheu diy modification

  • Hello,

    Did find some information about reducing vibration from motor/ rotating parts to things surrounding them. It is about drones.

    Of course the vibrations generated by a good turntable motor with a well designed power supply will not be very big because the speed is rather low but the tonabnemer is a sensible device so better stop these vibrations.

    http://ardupilot.org/copter/do…on-vibration-damping.html

    Maybe can pull the motor unit down to the zarge by using 3 silicon/rubber o-rings.

    Cover the motor unit with a 140/150 mm circle , keep the original feet of the motor unit or replace them with sorbothane and use 3 o-rings to pull the motor down onto the zarge.

    Any ideas are welcome!

    greetings, Ed

  • Hello,

    I got the correct POM platte today but i decided to use them both so i can make it 60 mm thick and make the bleischrott 50 mm high in the '' 3 kammer '' ( i think about 14 to 15 kilo of bleischrott) These will be closed by the original Scheu zarge.

    I also asked them to make a Pom tonarmbase that has a 30 mm 75 mm deep hole that will be filled with bleischrott too. POM is very hard to glue so i will use a 30 mm wooden scheibe that is used to repair wooden floors. You just use a rubber hammer to move it inside after you put in the bleischrott.

    Maybe i will something between the two POM platte like rubber but i am not sure. I think 13,5 kilo of POM and 14 kilo of bleischrott will already damp a lot.

    greetings, Edanalog-forum.de/wbboard/cms/index.php?attachment/39390/

    analog-forum.de/wbboard/cms/index.php?attachment/39391/

  • Hello,

    I started looking for a solution to mount the motorunit onto the zarge. A GOOD member here suggested alpha gel. I found these things.

    http://www.vibrationmounts.com/RFQ/VM110104.htm

    They all have an optimum load as you can see in the link/document. But it is easy to add some weight to the motor unit.

    I try to find gel pad to put between the two pieces of pom. I guess it must have some thickness to make it work? Maybe use sorbothane which is easier to find in sheets.

    I must think about it, read about or get some ideas here?

    I did order a new support for my groovemaster made from pom.

    There is a 30 mm 75 mm deep hole that is filled with bleischrott and a little bit of sand ( i think it will easier that will to get good contacts between all the things inside) I used wood like you see in the picture to cover the hole. Make the hole 30 mm and use a hammer to put the wood inside untill you weill not hear any movement inside the pom anymore.

    The pom alone was 594 grammes with the filling it will be 918 grammes so the arm can stay like a piece of art no need to attach it to the zarge haha.

    Of course there are 6 M5 threaded holes in the pom to mount it onto the zarge.arm support pom en lood.jpg

    Greetings, Ed

  • Hi Ed


    analog-forum.de/wbboard/gallery/index.php?image/122752/


    analog-forum.de/wbboard/gallery/index.php?image/122753/


    Im Gegensatz zu den Silikonfeeds , sind die Sylomer Pads in Ihrer Gewichts / Frequenzreso Bestimmung exakter , dennoch sind sie wie auch die Silikonfeeds nicht wirklich für eine Entkopplung für analoge Laufwerke geeignet . Silikon hat seine Werte variabel angegeben mit einer Gewichtsbelastung von - bis , dementsprechend variiert auch die Resofrequenz , die mit Sicherheit in das Resofenster des TA / Arm Konstrukt eingreift . Während das Sylomer , wie auch das Silikon auch nicht wirklich mit mindestens 6 dB darunter bleibt .


    Die einfachste / preiswerteste Lösung , die solchem Anspruch gerecht werden kann , sind Spiralfedern deren die fehlende Materialdämpfung/ Dichte , in Form von Öl oder Sylomer hinzugefügt werden sollte .


    Oben habe ich reales Dämpfungsverhalten von Sylomer als Bild eingelegt und Silikon die Silikonfeeds sind letztendlich „suboptimal“ .

    G / Otto

    The post was edited 1 time, last by Kawumm ().

  • Hello,

    Thanks for the information!

    I will use the Seismic pods which have a spring inside to isolate the Scheu from its surroundings. A friend of mine uses a Scheu in a '' wooden box filled with sand '' which stands on 3 Seismic pods.

    The 3 holes in my POM are filled with bleikugeln and sand. Only blei would make it to heavy for the type of pod i bought. In the UK they told me thery work best with a load close to maximum. The ones i have can take 48 kilo and my turntable will be around 45. The more heavy pod start at 48 kilo and then i would have to make the Scheu to heavy for me.

    I did attach a m8 schraube to a table so now the Scheu without motor and arm ( 41 kilo) is balanced on a 12 diameter ring!! Because the blei is concentrated in one area it makes a stable impression. Of course the center of gravity will move backwards when i install motor (2,5 kilo) and arm with lead filled pom base ( 1,4 kilo) .

    When i find the final center of gravity i will install the 3 pods in a circle. The diameter of the circle is limited by the dimensions of the pom. BUT most of the weight will be concentrated inside the circle.


    The construction that will support the 3 pods will be changed too. Because the pods will be installed after the Scheu is the right position in the audiorack. Probablly will make an aluminum? box at work with some m10 gewinde with 10 cn long bolzen so i can move the SCHEU up in the air to put the pods in the right position. When the pods are kinds of attached it is hard/impossible to move the Scheu around at more than 1 meter height.

    The alumium box will have 3 '' scheibe '' holz, pom, alumium under the pods and the rest of the space there will probably be bleischrott oder sand ( it is just 25 mm high)


    We will see.

    Greetings, Ed

  • Nice work, Ed!


    I would recommend considering an adjustment to the feet. wherever you place them, it might be useful to have the possibility to level the beast, or the platform which takes it.


    Cheers!

    Alex

  • Hello Alex,

    Inside the box i will put 3 70mm durchschnitt scheibe and the 3 pods will support on these 3. So if the center of gravity is correct , the 3 pods will have equal load so if the 3 scheibe are in correctly levelled the Scheu will be too. OF COURSE with 3 it is easier to level than with 4.


    I am not sure if isolation of the motorunit must be taken care of the same way as isolation of the complete laufwerk?

    A few days ago i read i read some people in the USA use blei in steuer von motorrad to reduce vibration!!!


    Greetings, Ed

  • Hello Ed,


    well, let's see. My experience says that, although everything is in the right place with the center of gravity, it might be usefull to have a slight reserve in adjustment left. I mean physical level like horizontal plane.


    I am not sure if isolation of the motorunit must be taken care of the same way as isolation of the complete laufwerk?

    I would say so, especially when the string is rigid. Then it can transfer motor vibration to the platter. You can avoid less vibration with the right combination of motor and it's Steuerung. It's always the system of both.


    A few days ago i read i read some people in the USA use blei in steuer von motorrad to reduce vibration!!!

    On motorbikes you have items called Lenkerendgewicht, which has this function, but it is to increase inertia, so the handlebar is less nervous. So, yes, I can imagine, that there some people experimenting with weight. But once in movement, it might create the opposite of the intended idea.

  • Da ein nivellieren , den Wirkansatz von der vertikalen Ebene , pointiert formuliert , in die Diagonale Ebene transferiert und somit dem Sinn eines Frequenzbereich fixierten Einsatzes konterkariert .


    um 2001 hatte ich einen PADUC Holz Derivat eines Scheu Premier gebaut . Befüllt mit Bleischrot und Sand ..1/2 Jahr später gab es eine Sedierung von dem Sand / Bleigemisch .


    Was den Motor betraf wurde dieser separat entkoppelt gestellt und die Zarge selbst , horizontal wie vertikal entkoppelt z.B. der Edelstahlblock zum Lackerblock des No.2 und im Prinzip dasselbe beim PADUC Scheu Premier . Das „dämpfende „ bzw. das Gewicht generierende Material Blei / Sand wurde ausgetauscht durch Bronze und DA zum erstenmal Sylomer benutzt !!


    Der sogenannte Lagerblock wurde zum Boden , wie zum Deckel mit Sylomer entkoppelt .


    Aus optischen Gründen wurde feines Bleischrot zum Auffüllen verwendet .



    original Premier mit MBL Sorbothan Bällchen entkoppelt


    analog-forum.de/wbboard/gallery/index.php?image/123191/


    Und


    PADUC Derivat mit völlig anderem Lagerblock / Spindel / Sylomer


    analog-forum.de/wbboard/gallery/index.php?image/123192/

  • Hello,

    Your German language is a bit to complicated for me sometimes lol.

    The 3 holes in the pom need to be covered with something because otherwise the sand can move in between the pom platte and the original Scheu zarge i think. Maybe cut a sylomer circle to put in between . Some people will say you need a good contact between the Scheu, the bleischrott and the pom other people say there should be some kind of isolation. Of course if you use the thinnest sylomer you can find you will achieve good contact but less isolation.

    I remember the Mitch Cotter turntable base that also used some kind of elastomer in several layers but something like 3 or 4 mm thickness.

    The French in the past ( 1980..... 1990) used something like perspex with lead sheets in between.

    I could at least try to isolate the motor unit with sylomeren because it is located on the pom platte. Dont have the space to put it somewhere else.

    Greetings, Ed

  • Hello,

    Your German language is a bit to complicated for me sometimes lol.


    Greetings, Ed

    Google transladet lol :


    Since a leveling, the active approach of the vertical plane, formulated pointed, transferred to the diagonal plane and thus counteracted the sense of a frequency range fixed use.



    By 2001, I had built a PADUC wood derivative of a Scheu Premier. Filled with lead shot and sand. 1/2 year later there was sedation from the sand / lead mixture.


    As far as the motor was concerned, it was separately decoupled and the frame itself, decoupled horizontally and vertically, e.g. the stainless steel block to the paint block of No.2 and in principle the same with the PADUC Scheu Premier. The "dampening" or the weight-generating material lead / sand was replaced by bronze and DA used for the first time Sylomer !!



    The so-called storage block was decoupled to the ground, as to the lid with Sylomer.
    For aesthetic reasons, fine lead shot was used for filling.





    original Premier decoupled with MBL Sorbothan balls



    And very important

    Paduc derivative with completely different bearing block - spindle geometry

  • Hello,

    Google translate does not work for complete sentences especially when it is about a technical subject. Sometimes better use a dictionary. And of course some people dont know how to compose proper sentences. Most people dont read books or newspapers anymore. I remember reading Audio, Stereoplay, das ohr, hifi exclusiv, those were the days.

    Today did drill the 60 mm holes in the pom. Difficult because the drill gets hots and the pom will melt so have to drill a few seconds, clean and cool down and then again.

    Did get the Seismic pods yesterday. They look well made. They can be adjusted in height but i think it is better to do the levelling outside the pod. Because if you turn up the pod in height the contact between the upper part and the spring is a bit wobbly.

    I will do a test on the kitchentable tomorrow.

    Greetings, Ed

  • Hello,

    I did add some holes in the pom base to fill with bleischrott like i did with the pom armbase in post 45. Tomorrow will check if the weight is more balanced then before. It already balanced like you can see in the photo but it was not compl;etely horizontal. NOW with some leadfilled holes in the corner opposite the motor it will be better.

    Greetings, Ed

    p.s total weight now is 46 kilo.

    As you can see one of the holes is filled with tube to isolate heating pipes because that side all ready because of the arm base and motorunitpom plus Scheu console.jpg

    Scheu pom loodgevuld.jpgScheu pom onderzijde.jpg

  • Hello,

    Now total weight is close to 46 kilo so no need to add more blei!Because the maximum weight of 3 pods is 48 kilo. I tried it on the kitchen table and the pods work very nice.

    I did add a blei ring inside the pod to make it a little higher. There is a M8 bolze inside the upper part of the pod to make it go up BUT if you move it up the upper part will sound like a loud bicycle bell when you hit it. After putting the blei ring and add some bitumen it doesnt ring anymore!

    I will replace the part in my audioregal where my turntable stands upon by 6 pieces of blei i made myself. The three small parts will be under the pods. They are 30 mm high. The bigger parts are 18 mm high so i have some space under the turntable for the M8 and M10 bolze i used for connected the pom and the original scheu zarge. I bought some wood and i will glue the blei parts to that wood. The wood will not bend because in the rack there are several verbindungen between the 25 mm tubes. The weight of the lblei total is 34 kilo.

    As you can see in the pictures i use a medical instrument and a nylon hammer to test if the blei works well. If it works well you will hear that the sound it not coming through the instrument but coming from outside. Cannot not really test the effect of the pods because the pods will only work if there is enough load on them.

    The audioregal i welded myself. It is not my actual job so it doesnt look that nice but it is very strong. Even with allready something like a 20 kilo amplifier inside i can stand on it with my 86 kilo. It is attached to the wall in all 4 corners so i am sure it can take more than 15 kilo.

    Next to the Scheu there will be my new phono amplifier that will be max 10 kilo? So 34+ 46 + 10 =90 will be ok.

    Greetings, Edaudioregal.jpg

    audioregal.jpgloodplaten.jpgloodplaten1.jpg